An Interview with Ted Morrissey, Brady Harrison, and Grant Tracey

The October 30 Final Thursday Reading Series features a live recording of the podcast A Lesson before Writing with co-hosts Ted Morrissey, Brady Harrison, and Grant Tracey. Morrissey is the author of numerous books, including the award-winning novels Mrs. Saville and Crowsong for the Stricken, and the publisher of Twelve Winters Press. Harrison is a scholar of Western American literature whose creative work includes the books A Journey to Al Ramel and The Term Between: Stories. Tracey is the author of the just-released novel, A Shoeshine Kill, the fourth book in the Hayden Fuller Mystery Series, and Fiction Editor for the North American Review. 

The Final Thursday Reading Series takes place at the Hearst Center for the Arts in Cedar Falls, Iowa. There will be an open mic at 7:00 p.m. (bring your best five minutes of original creative writing). The featured reading/podcast begins at 7:30 and will also be simulcast on Zoom. Click to register for a link.

Interview by Faith Okon. 

FAITH OKON: How did you three decide to start this podcast? What keeps you coming together for these conversations?

TED MORRISSEY: I know it was my idea or at my instigation, but I’m not exactly sure what got me thinking about it in particular. The three of us got together in the same physical space the first (and only, so far) time in Albuquerque, for the Southwest Writers Conference (in 2021, I think, or 2022) and had a blast talking about writing and books, etc. So doing a regular podcast would give us the opportunity to get together (remotely) and have those same kinds of conversations. I delayed starting it for a while because I thought I’d need special equipment, and software, and know-how. But then we started doing Zoom readings to launch books, and I realized we could use that technology to do a podcast. At first, I thought we’d just do a YouTube-based podcast, but some early watchers encouraged me to expand to other platforms, so I added Spotify and Apple Podcasts. I really enjoy our conversations and look forward to them every month.

BRADY HARRISON: The podcast! When Ted proposed it, I thought, sure, why not? What could be better: we get together once a month to talk about books, writing, publishing, journals, teaching, and more: what’s not to like? I look forward to catching up with Ted and Grant, and I especially like the old school, DIY feel of it: we have a topic in mind, but we also let the conversation go where it will, and we don't worry too much about tech or glam. (Grant and I were raised on punk, and back in the day, he used to invite me to sit in on his punk rock radio show, “The Spirit of ‘77,” and it feels like we just picked up where we left off: talking about the things that matter to us.) What I like most about the podcast: being in community with Ted and Grant and our listeners.

GRANT TRACEY: I just love hanging out with the guys and talking art. In the past few years, I’ve delved into writing a series of crafting crime articles for the North American Review’s Open Space platform, and when we get together, it expands my base of knowledge for future articles and helps me appreciate the work editors do. From both Ted and Brady, I’ve learned to have a greater appreciation for experimental literature and works that demand a lot from their readers. Brady’s new novel, A Journey to Al Ramel, is absolutely amazing, and it works on two levels: it’s accessible storytelling and has a sturdy adventure plot line, but it’s also rich in meta detailing, allusions, and connections to other works. And Sean Flynn shows up. How cool is that? 

FO: Throughout your discussions on the podcast, you’ve covered a wide range of topics related to writing and literature. How do you decide what themes to focus on for each episode?
TM: I select the featured story that we do in each podcast. Often times, though, I have in mind something Brady brought up or something Grant brought up in a previous episode, and that leads me to select this story versus that story. In the days leading up to a recording, one of us may jump on our text thread with an idea that we may want to talk about. Sometimes we actually get to that idea, but many times we don’t. The conversation just veers off in a certain direction, and we go with it. I teach creative writing for two different universities (undergrads for one, MFA students for another), so I’ll come up with ideas I want to talk about based on things that come up in my classes. Both Brady and Grant have a wealth of teaching experience, so I’m always curious how they might respond to a particular issue. In sum, the featured short story we’re going to talk about (recently published in a lit journal) provides some structure, and we have a vague idea of things we might want to address. But really, it’s free-flowing, and we never know for sure what we’re going to talk about. We never run out of things to say; we always have to cut off the episode.

BH: It’s just as Ted says: in the days leading up to the podcast, we’ll text back and forth: we should talk about X, or Y has really been on my mind of late (as I’m wrestling with a story or working on a novel or getting ready for classes), and we fire ideas back and forth and we sometimes get to them during the podcast and often we don’t. I like the energy of the conversation and the way things take on a life of their own. We have scores of topics we’d like to discuss about writing and writers and publishing and idea leads to idea—half the fun for me is how much I learn from our conversations. Most of all, I hope that our listeners get lots of ideas and practical advice about writing and publishing.

GT: I’m always blown away by what Ted and Brady have to say about the featured story for each podcast. They’re so smart and kind and empathetic to the work. And their genuine excitement creates an energy ball that we all toss around the room with vigor. It’s very cool. I always come away a richer man for having the conversation. I’d call our talks structured improv. We have a format, we have an opening topic, and then we riff. Sometimes, alas, I jump the gun and start talking about the featured story ahead of scheduled programming (because there’s something in the craft I want to get on Front Street and explore), much to the consternation of the fellas. LOL. 

FO: Have the discussions you’ve had on the podcast impacted your own writing or creative work? If so, how?

Ted Morrissey

TM: I find our conversations very stimulating. I get ideas for things to read and writing techniques to experiment with. Also, I’m forced to articulate things I have in mind but have never really fully grasped myself. Thinking through concepts and sharing them with these guys helps me to make those concepts more concrete and more useful. One specific example: I have a poetry collection coming out in 2026, and I thought about including a glossary with the collection. So I asked Grant and Brady what they thought: yes, glossary? No, no glossary? We had a really fascinating conversation about the pros and cons, and Brady and Grant came down on opposite sides of the question. Their feedback was really helpful (I’ve decided no glossary).

BH: Great questions. Just as Ted says, I learn from our conversations all the time. Every month, I get a chance to listen to really experienced writers talk about craft, and how to shape scenes, and how to handle dialogue and showing versus telling, and so much more. More, and as Ted also says, our conversations force me to think through and articulate (on the air!) my own practices and approaches and ideas. When I’m working on my own stuff, I often think: how would Ted handle this? How would Grant? I get to learn from deeply experienced and extraordinarily well-published writers, and it’s all for free! Best of all, it encourages me to keep evolving: we all have different approaches and philosophies, and I’m absorbing ideas and strategies all the time.

GT: Ditto to what Ted and Brady said. I’ve learned to have a greater appreciation for complex, experimental work. Moreover, Ted models, in my mind, what a good editor should be. If you like the work, publish it. Enter into the editorial process, but don’t hijack it. Respect the work and approach what you’re going to publish with humility, aligning yourself with the artist’s vision. In terms of my own writing, I learned that less can be more. By that, I don’t mean minimalism; I mean don’t try to create uncertainty for the sake of placing the readers in uncertainty. In my fourth Hayden Fuller novel, I got a little carried away with em-dashes at the end of every paragraph of dialogue, and I used free indirect discourse a bit too freely. I didn’t see my own flaws, but during one podcast, I went on and on about how I like the featured literary story for that week and how the writer mixed vivid prose with complex characterizations. The prose was clean, easy to follow, but dynamic. A few days later, Ted contacted me and said, kindly, “About that—your stories want to reach the truck drivers and the literary-minded, and I’m afraid they’re going to be confused by all the literary pyrotechnics on display and give up. I’ll publish the book as it is, but I want you to think about it.” I took the note, thought about it, and, in a final pass through of A Shoeshine Kill, made several changes for clarity. I think it makes the book much better. 

Brady Harrison

FO: What have been your favorite episodes or topics to discuss? Looking ahead, what are your plans for the future of the podcast?

TM: The only episodes that have been themed have been our October episodes, which have a Halloween-inspired theme. We talk about Gothic books, movies, and techniques of writing Gothic fiction. It’s a howling good time. Otherwise, we don’t have themes for our episodes. We talk about whatever comes up. In March, we’ll be at AWP in Baltimore. It will be the first time for Twelve Winters to have a booth at AWP. We probably won’t record an episode while we’re there, but we’ll interview various writers and use that material for bonus episodes (which we do from time to time).

BH: Agreed: I love the Halloween episodes. I often teach a course on the Brontës and the Gothic, and I can’t wait to talk about Gothic fiction and frights with Ted and Grant. More broadly, I also really enjoy discussing the stories that Ted selects. We cover a range, from very traditional to experimental, and some we love, and some we like less, but whatever the case, we dive as deeply as we can, in the time available, into the thematics and craft of each story. And, for the record: there’s a lot of truly astonishing work going on out there, and we’re glad to do what we can to spread the word.

GT: I love talking hockey, whenever we can talk hockey. 

Grant Tracey

FO: Is there any question I should have asked but didn’t? If so, can you ask and answer it?

TM: I talk to my students about the importance of writers having a community—other people who take writing and publishing as seriously as they do. Quite honestly, Grant and Brady are my community. They’re really the only people in my life who have such similar interests and experiences that I know they can relate to my goals and aspirations, my frustrations, my little victories. Their souls tick to the same rhythm, the same vibrations as mine, and that’s really important. I’m delighted to be their publisher but even more so to be their friend and colleague.

BH: Absolutely: why won’t Ted let Grant and me talk more about hockey during the podcasts?! (Just playin’, Ted! Grant and I grew up in Canada, so we come by our love for the game quite honestly.) I’ll close by agreeing with Ted: what’s best about the podcast, and working with Twelve Winters Press, is the community: we love books and stories and we love talking about writing and publishing, and we’re on each other’s side: I can’t wait to hear what the guys have been up to since we last met and to hear more about their ongoing work and publications and more. We may never be famous and rich, but we do get to do what we love, and I hope that that shows in the podcast. To quote Austin Powers, it’s all very groovy!

GT: I really love these guys. It’s a treat to get together and rap. I think we’re all simpatico, kindred spirits. We care about art, each other, our students, and all those aspiring writers who are tuning in. We respect and listen to each other (we don’t always agree), and I learn something from every episode. And I think we’re all humble. We talk about the need for writers to have rhino hide to keep going, and I think that’s our goal: inspire others to keep going, keep writing!!